TOPIC: going in for the filler consultation tomorrow

If anyone has any questions you want me to ask Heller let me know and I will write them all down and ask. I want to be thorough so I can decide to go forward or not and move on. Put them here or PM me. I did see on the Belafill site under the providers link, they tell you to give the patient an allergic response test since it is bovine collagen. They prick you with a drop of the stuff and you need to come back in a month to see if your body rejects it. There are people who\'s bodies have rejected it on realself, who did not do the test, and it looks like a mess. I want one of those, I am hoping he just gives me one when I am there.

I have a few.
How much for belafill only?
Why does he mix belafill and HA?
How often can we get more and if we can get as much as we want?
How much cc\'s are in a syringe? ...think that\'s it.

OK indiano123, here are yours and mine:

1.Why does he mix Belafill and HA?
2.How much for Belafill only? (Does he do HA only?)
3.How often do you need to wait between visits?
4.Who decides how much as you get in a visit / and in total?
4.How much cc\'s are in a syringe? Cannula or needle?
5.What happens when the HA absorbs? Is the collagen created by the BF even or lumpy as the HA reduces?
6.What kinds of gains for 30cc? Either mixed with HA, and just BF.
7.What is the shelf life of the HA assuming it is slowly absorbing. Is this something that needs to be done every year?
8.What is the feel of HA and BF vs BF only.
9.Does it move round as a graft, or feel like you can always mold it.
10.What happens if you have stretched or loose skin, is it just going to run towards the glans? What is keeping it in place?
11.edit * Has he preformed Girth procedure on patients w/ Dr. Loria\'s platinum silicone Girth procedure

I think that covers it unless someone wants to know anything else, plus I want him to look at my Dick and see the laxity of the skin issue and make recommendations.
I will post the answers to all of these questions wed night - assuming he does\'t cancel on me.

Im looking forward to it.

Hey hunkydory! Thanks for allowing us to give you our concerns and questions for your consultation. Through you at least we will know what\'s what with Heller. Can you ask him if he performs these Girth procedures on someone who has had Dr . Loria so called platinum silicone Girth procedure. Thanks a bunch

Sure thing, I added it to the list so I don\'t forget anything.

@hunkydory - 30cc seems like quite a lot. actually a hell of a lot i am just saying because I had 8cc (HA only, juvederm 4 / ultra plus) and its a very noticeable difference, much more than i would have imagined from my own experience with saline and pumping and stuff. i am going for a touch up type session for another 4cc in a week now that i see how this all \'works\' in practice. for sure at the outset i was thinking \'nothing less than 20cc is even worth trying\'. i have definitely revised my thoughts on that. i stand corrected.
see what Heller says, just my doc said he would not put in more than 8cc in one session, although he would be happy to add more after 2 to 4 weeks but only after he took a look at it, check how its doing and also be able to touch up any bits he or i thought would need it.

i am now definitely a supporter of the \'gradual build\' approach. i wasnt before but now i really do get it.
from a cost perspective, it makes no difference (at least, thats how its priced here) as its priced on volume used, not doctor time, but from an aesthetic - and psychological - perspective, there is a lot to be said for try it, review effect over a few weeks, add more if desired (or not) and review again. ok, i am no expert but what i know from my own procedure and mindset before, during, after is that pretty much everything was somewhat different to what i had anticipated and i am really glad that i am doing it this way. the first few days i was kind of disappointed. now, 9 days after the first procedure, very happy with the result.

obviously you need to do what works for you but just consider the option of a gradual build where you can keep reviewing and revising and stop just right when you are satisfied, rather than one big hit with the hope that everything turns out exactly as you imagine. particularly since the doctor is local to you, so you can go back a few times without great inconvenience and work towards the aesthetic result that you want.

on the question of loose skin, i am interested to say what Heller\'s view is.
my experience of the past week - and i am uncircumcised with plenty of loose skin from the pumping but i always have had plenty - is that the HA doesn\'t move around or flow down to the end or anything like that. its much too viscous to do that. i dont know exactly how but its kind of where it was put in albeit kind of slightly moveable and palpable. i dont quite know how else to describe it. but for sure it has not all run down into my Foreskin or anything like that.

Thanks for that MM. There was no way I was thinking of 30cc at a single time. It was more of a random number in my head to calculate total expenses based on the idea that 20cc of PMMA gives about .5\" if you are lucky. I am mostly trying to gauge expectations - financial and otherwise. But I get from your post that the 2 materials are not really comparable - PMMA/HA mixtures. I love that 8cc makes a noticeable difference.
I also only want the slow approach at this point. I definitely want to see how it goes at each step and have the option to stop if I think it is not looking so hot.

@hunkydory - i was always getting mixed up with those volumes of PMMA until i realised that the volume, say 20cc, included the carrier, which if it is 30% PMMA, is going to be 14cc, meaning you get 6cc of permanent stuff once the filler is absorbed (and until the tissue growth starts to happen). if its 10% PMMA, you are getting 2cc of PMMA and 18cc of absorbable filler. and thats when the things like 0.5inch gain from 20cc of 30% and 10cc of 10% or whatever started to add up right. because 30cc of stuff that doesn\'t absorb is a lot. like you are going to get 1.5 Inch extra Girth if that stuff just stayed as it is (depending on your starting size) but it would also be a bit like an overinflated sausage.

which might be the look you are aiming for


the gains v volume thing started to make more sense to me after that. although of course with PMMA the ultimate gain is from your own tissue regrowth around the PMMA \'beads\' rather than the stuff itself.

I never thought of it that way. Seems interesting, I always thought the higher amount of cc\'s the the more collagen you produce.

...

So I had my consultation today. He is not the warmest of guys which made things a little awkward at first. I didn\'t feel he was into being asked questions either, but perhaps he was just not in the mood, it was at the end of the day. Once we discussed where I work, which he knew of well, he seemed to brighten up and become much friendlier but this was at the end of the visit so it didn\'t translate into getting my questions answered. However, it did feel like if we started that way, it would have been a different visit.

He suggested I do FFT and said that he does not have the lumping issue other doctors have and that it lasts longer than HA. He said he does more Phalloplasty procedures than any other doctor in the US and has perfected the technique. I told him my concerns about the lumps anyways and switched the topic to the fillers.

When he said that he does not have the lumpiness issues with FFT, I lost a little confidence in the visit as I haven\'t heard anyone who has perfected the technique, but maybe he has - don\'t know. This was the first thing we discussed.

Everything I say is just what he told me, not meant as any kind of fact, everyone can decide for themselves the veracity of what I am writing. Bedside manner aside, he offers a lot of different procedures:

FFT - $4,500

Juviderm - 10cc $2,600, 20cc $4,900

Macrolane - 10cc $1,000, 20cc $1,800

He said that the difference between Macrolane which is HA and Juviderm (HA) is that the Macrolane is off-label in the US but is basically the same product as Juviderm.

Bellafil/Juviderm mix - 10cc $2,950

Bellafil/Macrolane mix - 10cc $1,950

Dermal Fat Grafts - $6,500

.
1.Why does he mix Belafill and HA?
2.How much for Belafill only? (Does he do HA only? - Yes)
He does not do Bellafil alone as he said it leads to a higher risk of lumps and nodules, but doesn\'t have this issue when mixing it as it evens out the distribution. Although he added that none of this stuff is perfect. He said the best results in terms of smoothness and aesthetics are DFG\'s. Which I kind of agree with, based on my experience. He said he never heard of them dying so far after the procedure. I asked if Nicorette could be the cause and he said no. He was surprised that anyone offered them 20 years ago but knew Dr. Reed.

3.How often do you need to wait between visits?
He does the 10cc\'s at once and said there was no real point to doing it in smaller increments. If you did 20cc\'s he would do that in one visit too, and it takes a few days to a week to set and get the best aesthetic result. We were specifically talking about the HA\'s at this point. When I asked about getting smaller amounts, he asked why would I do that - he said it is cheaper this way and makes no difference in outcome.

4.Who decides how much as you get in a visit / and in total?
You do in total, but he seems to start at 10cc\'s.

4.How much cc\'s are in a syringe? Cannula or needle?
Forgot to ask cannula or needle (sorry) - but he sells by the cc, not the syringe. I will get back on the syringe or cannula - but if I had to guess, syringe.

5.What happens when the HA absorbs? Is the collagen created by the Bellafil even or lumpy as the HA reduces?
He said no it does not become lumpy - it stays smooth. The Bellafil is 20% PMMA but I did not ask what the ratio is to HA, 50%/50% etc.

6.What kinds of gains for 30cc? Either mixed with HA, and just BF.
10cc = about 20% increase in Girth. Rule of thumb, BF/HA or just HA is similar in Girth increase per cc. but the Juviderm or Macrolane alone absorb much more quickly.

7.What is the shelf life of the HA assuming it is slowly absorbing. Is this something that needs to be done every year?
He said the shelf life of HA before it reabsorbs is anywhere from 6months to a year or more, depending on the individual and how they metabolize it.

8.What is the feel of BF/HA vs BF only.
He didn\'t really answer this clearly and I didn\'t press - he said it felt natural, and he does not offer BF only so it didn\'t matter. Mischiefmaker probably has the most accurate info on the feel of HA.

9.Does it move round as a graft, or feel like you can always mold it?
I need to email him with this one and get back to the board. I really want to know this one and can\'t believe I forgot - damn!

10.What happens if you have stretched or loose skin, is it just going to run towards the glans? What is keeping it in place?
He said he fact that my skin was stretched would not make a difference in outcome, but thought that I might need up to 20cc to fill it out. He said the dermal fillers hold them self in place, something Mischiefmaker mentioned to me as well. He examined my skin and said it was pretty stretched, something I knew. He did ask me if I had my ligs cut when he was examining my Dick, and I said yes. He asked if I gained anything from it and I said 1.25\"; but after a year and a half of Hanging and he said that\'s about what he gets from his procedure. Maybe he does, but I always thought that I was in the minority of gainers and it wasn\'t from the surgery IMO.

11. Has he preformed Girth procedure on patients w/ Dr. Loria\'s platinum silicone Girth procedure
Yes, you can get either of the soft tissue fillers if you have already had silicone, and he added that he just did one of these procedures this afternoon.

Last thoughts. He said he didn\'t do Bellafill alone as he was not sure of the outcome in terms of the lumpiness 15 - 20 years down the road, but Bellafill/HA combo would still set you up for that, wouldn\'t it? Not to freak anyone out - he didn\'t say it would, just that he didn\'t know.

The thing I really like about Dr. Reed is that he will tell you what he thinks, if a procedure sucks, a product is inferior, bad idea etc. He will talk you out of stuff too. This visit was more about selling me something - which is why I was there - but everything seemed to have equal weight, which as a reader of this board I would have to disagree with. I don\'t think some of these doctors know how much info some patients come in with based on this site.

I don\'t feel like I know enough to draw a conclusion but felt less comfortable after the visit as some of the info, such as the FFT, didn\'t sit well. He is a trained plastic surgeon however.

I will probably sit tight and think about this - I didn\'t walk away with a game plan.

Thanks hunkydory, this info helped a lot. I don\'t think I will be going to him. I only want something bellafil not a mixture of it and juviderm.

Sure thing. I don\'t think I would go back either. If something went wrong it didn\'t seem like he would care much, could be wrong it was just a first impression. Given he is one of the only doctors in NYC that does Phalloplasty I was expecting more, as you could corner a really huge market - 8,500,000 people live here and half have dicks - that is a lot of dicks to service, lol.