TOPIC: My journey with Dr. Victor Liu - Alloderm & Ligament (for girth & length)

ou812 wrote: So far would you say it was worth it even if you don't gain any Erect length? (Expense and recovery)

Yes 10000%. Would love to see some Erect length when all is said and done but I love that it hangs lower and you can see a nice bulge when I’m wearing shorts or sweats. Girth alone wouldn’t have done that for me.

Have you noticed any instability with elections? Any change in Erect angle?
Thanks

ou812 wrote: Have you noticed any instability with elections? Any change in erect angle?
Thanks

No, no changes to erection instability or angle. When erect my penis is firm and angles slightly upward just like prior to surgery. Mine also angles a little to the left just like it always has. So, no changes in angle, good or bad. I actually looked into this prior to surgery and also discussed it with Dr. Liu directly.

Dr. Liu addressed that briefly in the article published on PhalloBoards: phalloboards.info/a-plastic-surgeon-s-ap...to-penis-enlargement
"It is true that the suspensory ligament should not be totally detached at the proximal end so that there is no instability."

And here... bayareapenisenlargement.com/service/penis-enlargement-length/
"Another criticism of this procedure is that it destabilizes the penis because the suspensory ligaments are cut. This can be prevented by not cutting the suspensory ligaments all the way, but instead, detaching only 80% to 90% of the Ligaments; the remaining 20% to 10% of the attachment is sufficient to maintain stability of the penis."

skiman wrote: Glad to see things are going well!

Thanks @skiman ! Appreciate all your support.

My Erection is not unstable and I had all of mine cut. Just for contrast !

@Texas
@SouthBay612
Wouldn't you gain more length through stretching following the procedure if you had the entire ligament cut? Not keeping 10% attached

Texas wrote: My Erection is not unstable and I had all of mine cut. Just for contrast !

I’ve always struggled with double-negatives.

“not unstable”…
In plain English - is it good or bad?

123abc wrote:

Texas wrote: My erection is not unstable and I had all of mine cut. Just for contrast !

I’ve always struggled with double-negatives.

“not unstable”…
In plain English - is it good or bad?

Lol it’s a good thing @Texas has stable equipment!

Tyl2704 wrote: @Texas
@SouthBay612
Wouldn't you gain more length through stretching following the procedure if you had the entire ligament cut? Not keeping 10% attached

Not really sure…

I would think only having 10% of the ligament attached would make it easier to stretch the ligament that’s left and make gains versus trying to stretch the entire uncut ligament. Added benefit is you don’t lose stability which obviously must vary person to person since there are those reporting having the entire ligament cut with zero loss of stability. At the same time I’ve also seen people post that had the entire ligament cut and they did lose stability. If that make sense?

Here is a reply from Dr. Liu from our email conversation:

What is the thickest alloderm graft you allow for the procedure? 3.4 MM +/- 0.6MM And how does that compare to what Surgimend was offering? 4MM BECAUSE SURGIMEND IS FIRMER, IT TENDS TO APPEAR THICKER

Also I read this on PhalloBoards about your procedure "..detaching only 80% to 90% of the Ligaments; the remaining 20% to 10% of the attachment is sufficient to maintain stability of the penis" IF THE LIGAMENTS ARE 100% DETACHED, THE PENIS MAY BECOME UNSTABLE. IF SO, WHEN TRY TO PUSH DURING SEX THE PENIS MAY BE PUSHED IN UNDER THE BONE AND THE FUNCTIONAL LENGTH OF THE PENIS MAY BE DIMINISHED (THUS SHORTER) BY PUTTING SOME ADJACENT TISSUE HERE MAY LESSEN THIS PROBLEM BUT MAY NOT BE ADEQUATE

Do you not detach the entire ligament? Am I able to request that all of it be cut? I would prefer to get as much length and stretch from post weighted exercises as possible IT IS VERY DIFFICULT TO DETERMINE HOW MUCH INCREASE IN LENGTH COULD BE OBTAINED, THE MOST IMPORTANT FACTOR BEING HOW MUCH PENIS IS BEHIND THE BONE. MOST PEOPLE GET 3/4 TO 1 1/4 Inch INCREASE. THE POST-OPERATIVE MANAGEMENT CONSISTING OF MANUAL PULLING AND WEIGHTS PULLING ON THE PENIS (WE USE A SPECIAL DEVICE MADE BY US AND GIVEN TO THE PATIENT)
BEFORE YOU MAKE YOUR DECISION, YOU SHOULD COME AND SEE ME (FREE CONSULTATION)
HOPE THAT IS HELPFUL. IT IS A BIG DECISION. MAKE SURE YOU UNDERSTAND FULLY BEFORE COMMITING TO DO IT.
BEST WISHES TO YOU.

You mentioned the Alloderm is roughly 3.4 MM +/- 0.6MM thick, and the Surgimend was 4MM thick.
Does this mean that any given Alloderm sheet that you use for the procedure can vary from 2.8MM to 4MM in thickness?
If that's the case, are you able to select the thickest sheet you have to use for the procedure?
YES. I WILL CHOOSE THE THICKEST AVAILABLE

_______________________
Just wanted to post here as this thread has been a great informational read and in case any of this info helped others

@SouthBay612
Do you know what the thickness of the Alloderm that was used on you?
As I posted yesterday from my email convo with Dr. Liu, he mentioned the Alloderm is roughly 3.4 MM +/- 0.6MM thick (so ranges from 2.8MM to 4MM) and that he picks the thickest available at the time of procedure.

I think it would be super helpful/interesting if we could compare the thickness of the Alloderm used and your results, to mby understand what is achievable/some sort of baseline.

Hope all is healing up well, thanks!!

Tyl2704 wrote: @SouthBay612
Do you know what the thickness of the Alloderm that was used on you?
As I posted yesterday from my email convo with Dr. Liu, he mentioned the Alloderm is roughly 3.4 MM +/- 0.6MM thick (so ranges from 2.8MM to 4MM) and that he picks the thickest available at the time of procedure.

I think it would be super helpful/interesting if we could compare the thickness of the Alloderm used and your results, to mby understand what is achievable/some sort of baseline.

Hope all is healing up well, thanks!!

I’m sorry I actually don’t. Someone else has asked this question as well. I can ask him next time I’m in but it’s going to be a couple of weeks.

Tyl2704 wrote: Do you know what the thickness of the Alloderm that was used on you?
As I posted yesterday from my email convo with Dr. Liu, he mentioned the Alloderm is roughly 3.4 MM +/- 0.6MM thick (so ranges from 2.8MM to 4MM) and that he picks the thickest available at the time of procedure.

I think it would be super helpful/interesting if we could compare the thickness of the Alloderm used and your results, to mby understand what is achievable/some sort of baseline.

That’s not really how it works and frankly I don’t think even the doctor would know exactly how thick it is throughout because he’d have had to measured the sheet of alloderm in several spots to get the average thickness...

Alloderm’s thickness is not uniform. It varies though the material..

He showed me the box the aloderm comes in - and it said exactly what Dr. Liu emailed you:

Alloderm thickness: 3.4 MM
Variation: +/- 0.6MM thick
(so it ranges from 2.8MM to 4MM)

So that means that the first Inch of the material could be 3.4 mm thick, then 2.8mm, followed by 3.1mm, etc..

One of advantages of surgimend is that it comes from animal dermis which is much thicker and therefore the manufacturer can shave it in specific thickness sheets. So a 4mm piece is exactly 4mm throughout the sheet.
Human aloderm is not.

That’s why I wanted surgimend BUT it’s no longer an option.

Having said that, aloderm is still a nice option and as Dr. Liu said - with fillers one can achieve pretty much identical gains to surgimend..

Update: On Aug 14th, added 10cc PMMA (Bellafill) in shaft and 3-4cc PMMA/HA (Bellafill/Voluma) mix in glans. As mentioned in previous post I had a 'ring' near my base where I went too tight on my bandage and the fat dislodged a bit and clumped up on my underside. I also had one small area in the shaft where I could feel either the Alloderm edge where I think some fat just reabsorbed. Dr. Liu corrected both of these areas for free with filler, and I opted for just a bit extra because why the heck not?

It has been almost two weeks and I am attaching photos. Overall I am quite pleased with the appearance. It looks and measures just about 1/4 inch thicker. ALSO... after using weights for about six weeks my erect length is now about 1/4" longer . For those following this thread I had my lig cut and although I experienced a 1" flaccid length increase I wasn't seeing an erect length increase. With weights I am now seeing an increase. I took a bit of time off after the PMMA bit will now get back into my hanging routine.

Issues/Observations

• My penis has always curved slightly to the left, but now that it's bigger this curvature seems more significant. I was going to give this device a try ( www.unbend.me/ ) but am first checking with Dr. Liu to make sure it's okay. He doesn't want me using anything with vacuum or clamp but this one just literally stretches straight out. Any other tips here are welcomed!


• Dr. Liu's PMMA aftercare instructions are quite different from what I've read in this forum, like in the big Texas AFTERCARE post. Having said that, and after discussing with @123abc we both think this is likely because I had such a small amount done and it was really meant to be fix some targeted areas. This caused me a little anxiety for about a week because I didn't want to miss anything but after two weeks my results are looking great so all is good.


• Dr. Liu doesn't like how my incision scar is healing. It stretched a bit immediately after my initial procedure because I was manually stretching out the penis (b/c of the lig cut). He says at some point he wants to revise this. I'm hopeful it'll just heal more on its own. I'm using silicone scar cream to help with healing. If not, will probably revise in a few months.