PhalloBoards - An Online Community to Discuss Penile Girth Enhancement

OldZol123 wrote: Hi

I had pmma with Dr.Casavantes around 12 years ago. Just one session which gave a little boost but I had mostly forgotten about. I got married had kids and have just lived my life. My wife doesn’t even know about it.

Yesterday I have developed swelling in the whole area. It looks and feels all pumped up like it did post procedure. Nothing painful yet but it’s looking odd and appears to be swelling more and more.

I am a bit worried about what is happening and have no idea where to turn to or what to do next. Is there any known specialist in UK who I could contact? I see some of the mods from the old boards are still around. Could someone maybe shoot an old timer a pm? Thanks

You could reach out to @Androfill to take a look. They use Ellanse which is quite similar to PMMA in how it generates girth via collagen, and therefore reactions and complications are similar in nature as well.

May I ask, have you applied any strenuous physical force on your penis in the last 24 hours (aggressive masturbation, penis pumping, etc.)? Some men report temporary swelling after bouts of aggressive masturbation, sex, or penile exercises. This appears to be harmless and dissipates over days.

If not, it could be a late onset granuloma reaction, which are known, albeit rare complications that can occur with just about any dermal filler. I would not be alarmed however, these can be treated, however requires a Physician well versed in this area. Androfill would have physicians who would know the protocols to treat a FBG (granuloma), if this is indeed the case.

If you can upload photos it could help give us better context - alternatively you can email them to This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. as well.

Again, if there is no pain I wouldn't be alarmed but I would have it examined by someone who knows. A primary care doctor may have no clue what's happening and may end up prescribing a treatment plan that could exacerbate this issue. See someone who experience in this area --> either Androfill in the U.K. -or- if budget & logistics aren't an issue, even a week long trip to MX if that's in the cards.

And please keep the forum up to date, good luck!

MoMoney wrote:

Skeptical_One wrote:

MoMoney wrote: I'm basically settled on getting ~2 rounds of Ellanse with Aventi Derma. Reasons are varied, mostly because of apparent semi-permanency and hardness. I'm also implanted with a 3 piece inflatable penile implant, and my surgeons strong advise against PMMA for my specific case (in general I think PMMA has a lot of good things going for it) because the acrylic spheres could potential get into surgical sites in the future when I inevitably get a revision for the implant done. HA just seems like too much of a gamble of squishy, but I understand the point of try-before-you-commit. I just dont feel like messing around with a kinda-maybe option right now. Anyways, Ellanse seems like the right combination of hard/natural, longevity, and application to my specific situation.

To those who had Ellanse done, especially at Aventi Derma, can you recommend a hotel, either state-side or in Tijuana, that had a kitchen and was quiet?

How many days recommend to stay in town to have them check on post op outcome?

Anyone know of progress of Ellanse being brought back to the US?

How many days for Ellanse to "settle", or mostly "settle". If I need to travel back to the US after 7 days of post-op care in Tijuana, am I ok to have grower dick stuffed in my pants (assuming I do some continued massaging multiple times throughout the day)?

Goal is just to add ~.5inc, so i can hopefully get this done in just 1 to 2 trips. I'm not concerned about the aesthetics within reason, so if I get .5 inch in 1 trip but have some irregularities then I would be completely happy with that. Ideally I wouldnt go back for 5+ years, which seems like a realistic expectation. Could bring the SO with me, have a nice vacation for a few days, then do some dick TLC with Aventi and call it a win win.

Its been a fun journey learning about all of these fillers. Ultimately, hardness and duration appeal to me the most, so I went through the evolution of HA-Renuva-Ellanse.

Anything else I should know please chime in.

Well it seems like you have your decision figured out and I believe your goals are very attainable. You ought to be able to get 0.5" in one round almost certainly, and a follow-up round tend to be inevitable for touch-up (which will be minimal with the kind of volume you'll have injected). Heck, if you have a significant other who doesn't mind, you may even find any minor imperfections as tolerable and may not even need a 2nd round, that'd be for you to decide.

On a side note, I do want to dispel the HA squishy narrative (I'm not knocking your comments btw). I suppose you could argue that PMMA/Ellanse are firmer, but with the right brand of HA and an injector who knows where & how much to inject, I've been seeing an increasing number of men report satisfactory results. Sure, there are also reports of less-than-stellar results, but Revanesse HA and Voluma HA seem to be quite adequate for augmentation. You have to remember that penises have a natural "give" to the skin, you wouldn't want anything too firm especially when flaccid, that's sort of the problem with things like the Penuma implant. HA also tends to be better for aesthetic results because you aren't rely solely on collagen production for girth, which is why nodules and ridges are far more common with PMMA & Ellanse. I'm not advocating for one filler over another, I just find increasing reports of happy customers as indicative that this alleged squishiness is overblown or exaggerated, and largely brand & injector related (not all HA's are cross-linked the same way). However, this is an Ellanse topic so I digress.

Back at the topic -- I would definitely bring the significant other if they are supportive of your decision. It'd be nice for someone to hold the head of your penis stretched out while you massage the base and shaft, hah! Just be sure to resist the temptation of sexual contact, I wouldn't risk ANYTHING while the entry points are not FULLY healed. This procedure is smooth sailing so long as you avoid infection, especially when it's relatively easy to avoid.

Tijuana may have a reputation but I'd argue Oakland, Chicago, and Memphis feel less safe. It's just a matter of getting to where you need to go and back. I've been there a few times and each time was a breeze and I never felt unsafe. Transportation service is provided by the Clinic, and they have Uber should you feel a little adventurous. I've had some great food while there, you can probably look up Yelp (or some travel guide) for restaurant locations and Uber there and back to the Hotel. The Grand Hotel is the most convenient (it's adjacent to Avanti Derma's office and a literal walk + elevator + hop + skip away), and they also have a Marriott which I've heard nice things about (but may require a cab/Uber to get to the Clinic).

If you stay long enough, you could even venture into San Diego which is literally minutes away (although make sure to go at the right time of day because border lines can be quite long).

Skep I actually very much appreciate you diving further into HA. Its actually been a very difficult decision - trying HA first or jumping right into the longer-term options. I will trust you that HA can produce good / non-squishy results if you choose a quality doc/filler.

My continued concerns with HA are the following:
<>I will likely need 2 procedure just to get .5in. The doctor that I want to use is a 7 hour drive from me. Because he is a Urofill guy he only uses 6cc's max first round, as they believe too much too soon increases risk of migration and squishiness.
<>HA seems to be susceptible to quicker degradation due to the use of a dick pump and consistent high physical intensity lifestyles, both of which apply to me. While I can chuck out $6-10k to reach .5+ with temp filler, if it lasts less than 1 year its just not worth it to me
<>IIRC Avanti Derma prefers people not to have had HA prior to Ellanse or PMMA. Because I have an 3 piece inflatable implant, I am already on the list of non-preferred patients as per their website. I'm not sure if they would deny me if I have too many checks against me.

I will be scheduling a virtual consult with AD soon to ask some specifics regarding my situation.

If there are people who have had longer term success with HA (12+ months before needing a top off) and use a dick pump and are extremely physically active, then I would consider. Unfortunately a lot of these speculations are based on a few forum observations and some conversations with guy/gals who have get facial fillers are report shorter durations during high activity. But I also have no idea what fillers they used, quality of doc, ect. Again, a ton of speculation here, but a significant amount of time and $$ on the table.

I wasn't trying to dissuade you from Ellanse, simply trying to balance the narrative around HA - you bring up valid concerns on your end and like I've iterated previously, it appears you have set your sights on Avanti Derma and I think you'll be satisfied with your decision.

Keep us up to date with your virtual consultation with AD, didn't realize they offered that (assumed either phone or in-person). Let me know how it goes, I can perhaps convince them to make it more abundantly clear they offer this service, very useful for many who can't fly to Mexico on a whim.

Skeptical_One wrote:

MoMoney wrote: I'm basically settled on getting ~2 rounds of Ellanse with Aventi Derma. Reasons are varied, mostly because of apparent semi-permanency and hardness. I'm also implanted with a 3 piece inflatable penile implant, and my surgeons strong advise against PMMA for my specific case (in general I think PMMA has a lot of good things going for it) because the acrylic spheres could potential get into surgical sites in the future when I inevitably get a revision for the implant done. HA just seems like too much of a gamble of squishy, but I understand the point of try-before-you-commit. I just dont feel like messing around with a kinda-maybe option right now. Anyways, Ellanse seems like the right combination of hard/natural, longevity, and application to my specific situation.

To those who had Ellanse done, especially at Aventi Derma, can you recommend a hotel, either state-side or in Tijuana, that had a kitchen and was quiet?

How many days recommend to stay in town to have them check on post op outcome?

Anyone know of progress of Ellanse being brought back to the US?

How many days for Ellanse to "settle", or mostly "settle". If I need to travel back to the US after 7 days of post-op care in Tijuana, am I ok to have grower dick stuffed in my pants (assuming I do some continued massaging multiple times throughout the day)?

Goal is just to add ~.5inc, so i can hopefully get this done in just 1 to 2 trips. I'm not concerned about the aesthetics within reason, so if I get .5 inch in 1 trip but have some irregularities then I would be completely happy with that. Ideally I wouldnt go back for 5+ years, which seems like a realistic expectation. Could bring the SO with me, have a nice vacation for a few days, then do some dick TLC with Aventi and call it a win win.

Its been a fun journey learning about all of these fillers. Ultimately, hardness and duration appeal to me the most, so I went through the evolution of HA-Renuva-Ellanse.

Anything else I should know please chime in.

Well it seems like you have your decision figured out and I believe your goals are very attainable. You ought to be able to get 0.5" in one round almost certainly, and a follow-up round tend to be inevitable for touch-up (which will be minimal with the kind of volume you'll have injected). Heck, if you have a significant other who doesn't mind, you may even find any minor imperfections as tolerable and may not even need a 2nd round, that'd be for you to decide.

On a side note, I do want to dispel the HA squishy narrative (I'm not knocking your comments btw). I suppose you could argue that PMMA/Ellanse are firmer, but with the right brand of HA and an injector who knows where & how much to inject, I've been seeing an increasing number of men report satisfactory results. Sure, there are also reports of less-than-stellar results, but Revanesse HA and Voluma HA seem to be quite adequate for augmentation. You have to remember that penises have a natural "give" to the skin, you wouldn't want anything too firm especially when flaccid, that's sort of the problem with things like the Penuma implant. HA also tends to be better for aesthetic results because you aren't rely solely on collagen production for girth, which is why nodules and ridges are far more common with PMMA & Ellanse. I'm not advocating for one filler over another, I just find increasing reports of happy customers as indicative that this alleged squishiness is overblown or exaggerated, and largely brand & injector related (not all HA's are cross-linked the same way). However, this is an Ellanse topic so I digress.

Back at the topic -- I would definitely bring the significant other if they are supportive of your decision. It'd be nice for someone to hold the head of your penis stretched out while you massage the base and shaft, hah! Just be sure to resist the temptation of sexual contact, I wouldn't risk ANYTHING while the entry points are not FULLY healed. This procedure is smooth sailing so long as you avoid infection, especially when it's relatively easy to avoid.

Tijuana may have a reputation but I'd argue Oakland, Chicago, and Memphis feel less safe. It's just a matter of getting to where you need to go and back. I've been there a few times and each time was a breeze and I never felt unsafe. Transportation service is provided by the Clinic, and they have Uber should you feel a little adventurous. I've had some great food while there, you can probably look up Yelp (or some travel guide) for restaurant locations and Uber there and back to the Hotel. The Grand Hotel is the most convenient (it's adjacent to Avanti Derma's office and a literal walk + elevator + hop + skip away), and they also have a Marriott which I've heard nice things about (but may require a cab/Uber to get to the Clinic).

If you stay long enough, you could even venture into San Diego which is literally minutes away (although make sure to go at the right time of day because border lines can be quite long).

Skep I actually very much appreciate you diving further into HA. Its actually been a very difficult decision - trying HA first or jumping right into the longer-term options. I will trust you that HA can produce good / non-squishy results if you choose a quality doc/filler.

My continued concerns with HA are the following:
<>I will likely need 2 procedure just to get .5in. The doctor that I want to use is a 7 hour drive from me. Because he is a Urofill guy he only uses 6cc's max first round, as they believe too much too soon increases risk of migration and squishiness.
<>HA seems to be susceptible to quicker degradation due to the use of a dick pump and consistent high physical intensity lifestyles, both of which apply to me. While I can chuck out $6-10k to reach .5+ with temp filler, if it lasts less than 1 year its just not worth it to me
<>IIRC Avanti Derma prefers people not to have had HA prior to Ellanse or PMMA. Because I have an 3 piece inflatable implant, I am already on the list of non-preferred patients as per their website. I'm not sure if they would deny me if I have too many checks against me.

I will be scheduling a virtual consult with AD soon to ask some specifics regarding my situation.

If there are people who have had longer term success with HA (12+ months before needing a top off) and use a dick pump and are extremely physically active, then I would consider. Unfortunately a lot of these speculations are based on a few forum observations and some conversations with guy/gals who have get facial fillers are report shorter durations during high activity. But I also have no idea what fillers they used, quality of doc, ect. Again, a ton of speculation here, but a significant amount of time and $$ on the table.

MoMoney wrote: I'm basically settled on getting ~2 rounds of Ellanse with Aventi Derma. Reasons are varied, mostly because of apparent semi-permanency and hardness. I'm also implanted with a 3 piece inflatable penile implant, and my surgeons strong advise against PMMA for my specific case (in general I think PMMA has a lot of good things going for it) because the acrylic spheres could potential get into surgical sites in the future when I inevitably get a revision for the implant done. HA just seems like too much of a gamble of squishy, but I understand the point of try-before-you-commit. I just dont feel like messing around with a kinda-maybe option right now. Anyways, Ellanse seems like the right combination of hard/natural, longevity, and application to my specific situation.

To those who had Ellanse done, especially at Aventi Derma, can you recommend a hotel, either state-side or in Tijuana, that had a kitchen and was quiet?

How many days recommend to stay in town to have them check on post op outcome?

Anyone know of progress of Ellanse being brought back to the US?

How many days for Ellanse to "settle", or mostly "settle". If I need to travel back to the US after 7 days of post-op care in Tijuana, am I ok to have grower dick stuffed in my pants (assuming I do some continued massaging multiple times throughout the day)?

Goal is just to add ~.5inc, so i can hopefully get this done in just 1 to 2 trips. I'm not concerned about the aesthetics within reason, so if I get .5 inch in 1 trip but have some irregularities then I would be completely happy with that. Ideally I wouldnt go back for 5+ years, which seems like a realistic expectation. Could bring the SO with me, have a nice vacation for a few days, then do some dick TLC with Aventi and call it a win win.

Its been a fun journey learning about all of these fillers. Ultimately, hardness and duration appeal to me the most, so I went through the evolution of HA-Renuva-Ellanse.

Anything else I should know please chime in.

Well it seems like you have your decision figured out and I believe your goals are very attainable. You ought to be able to get 0.5" in one round almost certainly, and a follow-up round tend to be inevitable for touch-up (which will be minimal with the kind of volume you'll have injected). Heck, if you have a significant other who doesn't mind, you may even find any minor imperfections as tolerable and may not even need a 2nd round, that'd be for you to decide.

On a side note, I do want to dispel the HA squishy narrative (I'm not knocking your comments btw). I suppose you could argue that PMMA/Ellanse are firmer, but with the right brand of HA and an injector who knows where & how much to inject, I've been seeing an increasing number of men report satisfactory results. Sure, there are also reports of less-than-stellar results, but Revanesse HA and Voluma HA seem to be quite adequate for augmentation. You have to remember that penises have a natural "give" to the skin, you wouldn't want anything too firm especially when flaccid, that's sort of the problem with things like the Penuma implant. HA also tends to be better for aesthetic results because you aren't rely solely on collagen production for girth, which is why nodules and ridges are far more common with PMMA & Ellanse. I'm not advocating for one filler over another, I just find increasing reports of happy customers as indicative that this alleged squishiness is overblown or exaggerated, and largely brand & injector related (not all HA's are cross-linked the same way). However, this is an Ellanse topic so I digress.

Back at the topic -- I would definitely bring the significant other if they are supportive of your decision. It'd be nice for someone to hold the head of your penis stretched out while you massage the base and shaft, hah! Just be sure to resist the temptation of sexual contact, I wouldn't risk ANYTHING while the entry points are not FULLY healed. This procedure is smooth sailing so long as you avoid infection, especially when it's relatively easy to avoid.

Tijuana may have a reputation but I'd argue Oakland, Chicago, and Memphis feel less safe. It's just a matter of getting to where you need to go and back. I've been there a few times and each time was a breeze and I never felt unsafe. Transportation service is provided by the Clinic, and they have Uber should you feel a little adventurous. I've had some great food while there, you can probably look up Yelp (or some travel guide) for restaurant locations and Uber there and back to the Hotel. The Grand Hotel is the most convenient (it's adjacent to Avanti Derma's office and a literal walk + elevator + hop + skip away), and they also have a Marriott which I've heard nice things about (but may require a cab/Uber to get to the Clinic).

If you stay long enough, you could even venture into San Diego which is literally minutes away (although make sure to go at the right time of day because border lines can be quite long).

I'm basically settled on getting ~2 rounds of Ellanse with Aventi Derma. Reasons are varied, mostly because of apparent semi-permanency and hardness. I'm also implanted with a 3 piece inflatable penile implant, and my surgeons strong advise against PMMA for my specific case (in general I think PMMA has a lot of good things going for it) because the acrylic spheres could potential get into surgical sites in the future when I inevitably get a revision for the implant done. HA just seems like too much of a gamble of squishy, but I understand the point of try-before-you-commit. I just dont feel like messing around with a kinda-maybe option right now. Anyways, Ellanse seems like the right combination of hard/natural, longevity, and application to my specific situation.

To those who had Ellanse done, especially at Aventi Derma, can you recommend a hotel, either state-side or in Tijuana, that had a kitchen and was quiet?

How many days recommend to stay in town to have them check on post op outcome?

Anyone know of progress of Ellanse being brought back to the US?

How many days for Ellanse to "settle", or mostly "settle". If I need to travel back to the US after 7 days of post-op care in Tijuana, am I ok to have grower dick stuffed in my pants (assuming I do some continued massaging multiple times throughout the day)?

Goal is just to add ~.5inc, so i can hopefully get this done in just 1 to 2 trips. I'm not concerned about the aesthetics within reason, so if I get .5 inch in 1 trip but have some irregularities then I would be completely happy with that. Ideally I wouldnt go back for 5+ years, which seems like a realistic expectation. Could bring the SO with me, have a nice vacation for a few days, then do some dick TLC with Aventi and call it a win win.

Its been a fun journey learning about all of these fillers. Ultimately, hardness and duration appeal to me the most, so I went through the evolution of HA-Renuva-Ellanse.

Anything else I should know please chime in.

P-Long wrote: Thank you for your interesting question. I have a lot of experience with the 'steel cord' on the dorsal aspect of the penis because it causes penile curvature (peyronies) in men. A modification of the P-Long protocol should address this. I would suggest using the RestoreX device available on P-long.com but curving the penis ventrally (down) to accentuate the tension on the 'steel cord.'

What if I like the curve in my penis? The infact I wish it was more curved as it compensates for my lack of size. I would like to gain an inch in girth and length without loss of my curve is that possible with p-long?
Also you mentioned you can't pump with filler like ellanse and HA. Is there a reason for this?

Frankie4toes wrote: I was thinking of getting the penile lengthening from Rejuvall and was considering the fat transfer at the same time. It seems like very few people are going with the fat transfer over other methods for girth increase. I’m new to all this and am wondering why that is? I like the idea of doing both length and girth at the same time and like that the fat transfer is permanent but I feel like I’m missing something. Any advise is appreciated, thanks.

The issue with fat-transfer are two factors:

(1.) Its history.
During the 2000s, fat-transfer was really the only filler option marketed since dermal fillers hadn't picked up in popularity for its use in the penis. During this time, many doctors would give the patient what they wanted, which often meant overfilling the shaft with high volumes of fat. Not surprisingly, this fat needs a blood supply to survive, and your body can vascularize the new tissue only so quickly, meaning excessive fat may and likely will die off. This explains why modern approaches to fat include layering it incrementally (like brick-laying) over multiple appointments to ensure sufficient blood supply, combining fat with other fillers, and/or the use of platelet rich plasma (PRP) to expedite the healing & vascularization process.

(2.) The advent of filler alternatives.
In the 2010s, new filler options were popping up, and much of their allure was that you wouldn't have harvest fat; this was especially noteworthy because you had to have sufficient amount of the right kind of fat the doctor would need for a successful result. You had the boom of PMMA in 2011, and the subsequent popularity of Ellanse and Hyaluronic Acid (HA) in the years that followed. Now that there are multiple options, fat-transfer ended up losing some of the phalloplasty market share.

This is the answer to your why question. In my opinion, when performed by an experienced and qualified practitioner (which Rejuvall certainly are), fat-transfer is very much a viable option and its best attribute is that is your own tissue, likely making it the least prone to an adverse foreign body reaction (if at all). I hope that helps.

6x5to6x7 wrote:

Lnpleaeu wrote: Thank you both so much for the detailed answers. I have put in the request for the consultation and the office has not been reaching out to me yet. I might try to call then tomorrow on my day off. I also have put in a request for 2 weeks off. I also have 2 days off in a row weekly so i can always flight back to remove the stitches. I have an office job so hopefully if I have to wear a hanging or stretching device, it would not be too visible nor too complicated to remove to go pee and put it back on easily. The recovery of 6 to 8 months is a a bit frustrating but I guess everything comes with a price. Idk if I read it here or somewhere else that filler or fat injection is kinda squishy and when you are having sex, the filler can be pushed to the base and kinda stick outside. Having the surgery with Surgimend, do you guys have the same problem? Or it would be more natural looking, feeling, and functional. Sorry if the question is too personal. Perhaps, Dr. Liu will explain it better.

Again, thank you so much for the detailed responding!

Hey brother. Just wanted to offer up my experience with PMMA. I have a thread going you can read. I’m only chiming in because you stated fillers look fake or maybe bunch up with sexy and might feel squishy, etc. I can’t speak for all fillers and some of that might be true. I can speak to the PMMA filler treatment I had done in December by Avanti Derma. It’s not squishy, does not feel fake, when I’m erect my dick is rock hard, my veins are already back. My dick is very natural looking and feeling. I actually am going in for round 2 next month because the results of round 1 were so great. I’m extremely happy and so is my wife. You’re recommended to not have sex for at least two weeks, but I had sex on day 6. I’m not recommending that, but I’m just saying…. I have as good or better results without having to go under the knife and endure a 6-9 month healing process. To each their own, but my goal was to achieve the safest, least invasive process with the best results. Hit me up if you have any questions. I just cringe at the thought of surgery when Avanti offers such a great result without surgery. All that said, I agree that the procedure I had done probably won’t help you with erect length.

If someone is considering permanent filler, then I think having a dermal graft is a good choice, because if something goes wrong with the filler it has to go out through surgery anyhow.

Besides, having a dermal graft is likely to give better results. You will not have to remove it because the result was bad, but rather in the rare case there is some complications.

Honestly though, I am a bit concerned how these dermal grafts do long-term, for example 10-20 years. If there are some complications, it has to be removed through surgery.

Even though dermal grafts have been done for nearly 3 decades, it is hard to say whether they are really permanent. However, I guess the same can be said for PMMA. Who knows if the filler might have to be removed for some reason?

Second, like you wrote, surgery should not be underestimated. You have to be strong mentally to cope with it, because it is your penis, but PMMA is also permanent and for that reason any complications might be devastating.

OP wrote that he had some temporary penile retraction, which is common, but it is enough to really freak someone out who is not so strong mentally. I believe that I had some penile retraction too after the surgery, and it gave me a lot of anxiety.

My point is: I believe it is a much better idea to start with HA, and if someone feels that they want to up their game, they can consider surgery or PMMA later. In my opinion, first-timers should not be encouraged to get surgery or permanent fillers. Androfill wrote it recently on the forum that they strongly discourage first-timers from having Ellanse.

Finally, I want to say that Dr. Liu has a treasure trove of information on his website. I wish another Q&A could be done with him.

Linnea Safe is more affordable and has a higher percentage of PMMA. 30% vs 20% for Bellafill so you'll see more gains in addition to it being cheaper. I would bet Carney is the most experienced and probably the most skilled at this. Morales is really good but carney has been in the game longer. I'm sure Rupeka is good as well. Casavantes has written about why he loves Linnea Safe over Bellafill. It was a no brainer for him. If it was approved here in the US, the US doctor's would use it.

The US isn't giving you any protections my friend. Guys worrying about Mexico being a bad place are worrying for no reason. There are bad doctors there like there are here. Morales and Avanti isn't one of those operations. I'd put a lot of money on the US having way more cases of penises getting jacked up bad.

I'm considering Bellafill only due to the fact Carney (and Rupeka?) Seem to welcome doing it for Ellanse patients. At some point I'll probably want to go with permanent filler because Ellanse is expensive compared to Linnea Safe (and Bellafill considering Bellafill is permanent). As far as I know, it's Avanti's practice not to inject PMMA into penises which have Ellanse. We don't have any reports of an Ellanse patients getting PMMA yet to my knowledge and it will be interesting to hear how this goes. But if you look at facial studies, I'm sure it's been done before.

I’ll preface this with I’m a previous patient that’s had a couple sessions with Morales (and have met and talked with Casavantes).

There are countless patient journals on here who have used multiple clinics/practitioners. I can't summarize them all and honestly... I spent the time to dig and read and follow progress for years myself. So I'm not big on providing countless extra summaries for people on an individual basis when there is so much of that available now compared to even when I went in.

Avanti likely would boast Linnea is better in terms of dick enhancement because for the average patient it frankly is. It's less expensive, the sphere quality is at least as good if not better, the carrier is better suited to people's tendencies to be lazy and also having to live their lives (it absorbs quicker meaning less time babysitting). They also can boast that because, and maybe a practitioner can correct me if I'm wrong, they have very likely injected more penises than any other single clinic on the planet. They definitely have done the most with PMMA (and possibly Ellanse). And their experience and patient numbers of Linnea vs any that have done Bellafill is likely at least a few multiples.

This will sound like I'm being a dick. But the reality is there are more documented cases of Linnea patients available than most else. Casavantes is one of the only ones to actually publish a peer reviewed PMMA paper to my knowledge in terms of girth augmentation. Casavantes has almost single handedly done more to make this 'less scary' than any one else.

Now you have all these other great practitioners advancing things. Oates seems awesome. Listen to his Podcast. There's others, I just don't really follow the absorbing temp filler side of things. I've read some sketchy experiences of one Bellafill practitioner (not one of the ones Skeptical has mentioned to be clear). But that comes down to more of an assembly line style of the American cosmetic industry.

This is long winded. But do whatever you have to in order to gain access here to everything and go to the old 2.0 forum to just browse (I find the layout superior... Sorry Skeptical lol). And just read through experience threads.

The earliest PMMA patient on here has even posted recently that he's healthy and fine.

You're going to either have to just dig and read and research or trust one person giving you every bit of info on a platter.

And whichever route you go, definitely do not expect 'perfect' or some idea of some exact dick you want to possess. It's gradual enhancement, or should be, and in my case I've always been about function so I'm easy to please.

Pepperoni wrote: Everything still healing nicely and happy with the results? Anything that you would have added or prefer not to have done? Being in Korea and not having a Korean number my access to the internet is limited as it automatically assumes that I’m a minor and restricts what I can view. However last night my home carrier AT&T must have picked up or something because for a hour or so I could search and watch anything so I YouTubed 5S surgery and watched the entire procedure with the degloving, megaderm, liganomettolysis,etc It hurt my stomach so badly, I’m such a whimp. You commented on the other thread I was in about the degloving. That Proud must use a different terminology they must because that video I can only assume that was degloving they removed all the skin from the shaft to put on the dermal graft. I see that you had degloving are you happy that you went this route and just didn’t get filler? Dr Kim is very clear on his website to avoid surgery which he offers and just do filler because it’s safer.
You’ve been such a huge help @Screen2584 with me making the decision to move forward with this with everything that you shared. I’m a little over a week away from surgery. I called Proud last week to see if we could move the surgery sooner but they said that they’re booked up and no spaces were available.

I have been thinking about you, knowing your surgery is coming up, and I can imagine that the wait must be hard. Naturally, there is a lot of hesitation, but I believe that the wait can be good because it also gives you opportunity to reconsider whether or not you want to go ahead with the surgery.

When I read about any kind of dermal graft surgery, it seems that many clinics want to avoid mentioning "degloving". It sounds scary, and when you look it up, it sounds very alarming. I saw some videos of it, and it is enough to watch just for a few seconds to be terrified. Even a picture of it looks terrifying.

I wish I could say it just looks scary, but there is definitely a risk to this kind of procedure. As I understand it, the risk is damage to the neurovascular bundle, which is what gives you an erection. Other complications of nerve damage are persistent pain.

That is also the risk with permanent fillers that if there are complications then degloving is needed to remove as much of the filler as possible. This is a risk with for example Ellanse or PMMA. Based on what I read, some of it might not be able to be removed, and during the removal procedure there is a risk of damage to the neurovascular bundle.

When it comes to inserting dermal grafts, I read different terms used, such as describing it as a procedure similar to circumcision while avoiding mentioning "degloving", but I believe that they are always doing degloving. The dermal graft has to be stitched using sutures, and I do not see how this can be done without degloving the penis.

I even read clinics describe that the dermal graft is "injected" into the penis, but again I do not think this is accurate. As far as I know, the dermal graft always needs to be sutured, and this can only be done by degloving the penis. Clinics simply avoid mentioning the term.

Besides the risk during surgery, there is the risk that the dermal graft has to be removed for some reason in the future, and then the penis has to be degloved again. Then there is the risk of neurovascular damage occurring.

As you can imagine, I do not want to encourage anyone to have this kind of procedure. At the same time however, many people do have permanent filler, and there is a risk with that too. Then dermal graft might certainly be an alternative.

Knowing what I know now however, the only procedure I would be comfortable to have in retrospect would have been HA filler, and it is the only thing I would think is safe enough to recommend to others. If something goes wrong, it can just be dissolved, unlike permanent filler.

I am glad that you read about alternatives, such as MegaFill, but I do not know if Dr. Kim truly prefers it because it is like he claims superior and safer, or because it is simply much more simple than MegaDerm. It astonishes me however that Proud Urology can perform the 5S procedure as quickly as they say. Everywhere I read that when degloving the penis it is a lengthy surgery.

As for my own recovery: everything generally seems okay, but the sites of the incision do still get irritated easily, for example when wearing underwear that rubs against the incision sites. Like I mentioned, the incisions are barely visible now, and the pain there is minimal and usually not noticeable at all.

I have no pain in the penis, except once in a while there can be a sudden sensation of pain that lasts for a couple of seconds. It can happen once a day or less frequently. I do not feel so worried about it, because if it was nerve damage, I think the pain would be persistent.

The foreskin is still a bit tight and swollen, but I can pull it back behind the glans during erection. I do some stretching every day, and I believe that might be causing the swelling, but it is also important in order to loosen the foreskin. I am not sure if this is going to become an issue or if it will pass.

It is so mild that I think no honest urologist would do anything about it. There is preputioplasty, which is a much milder form of circumcision, but I think my tightness is too mild for it to be an option, as I believe circumcision is risky. Outside of the USA it is not a common procedure in many parts of the world, and strongly discouraged.

As for erections, it does seem no different from before, and I do not believe I had any penile retraction. I believe this would be noticeable, so I think it did not happen. There is no curvature either, but during erection the dermal fat graft can be felt.

The bulge I previously mentioned definitely seems less noticeable from when I first noticed it, both when erect and flaccid, however I think it is unavoidable that the dermal fat graft will be felt or noticed in some way. Fillers generally seem much more noticeable, with a less pleasing aesthetic result for many, it would seem.

For me the hardest thing post-surgery has been the constant worry. Not because there have been complications, but because there is the risk of complications, especially during the recovery period.

SolLhilll wrote: I messaged AvantiDerma asking about the pricing for their HA but I’ve yet to hear back. Has anyone gotten HA from them recently and if so what was their pricing like? I’m in the California Bay Area and HA runs about 550-600/ml here which is a lot compared to the international prices I’ve seen.

To be honest that's on the lower end of pricing I've seen in the States, and can run even higher; Orange Country Sponsor Dr. Tsay's PhalloBoards Special of $5,500 for 10mL is discounted from the original rate of $7,500, which falls right into about the average rate seen around the country. Note*- I normally don't post physician pricing on the forum, especially current rates, but this one in particular happens to be a live PhalloBoards offer and therefore does not apply to my normal guidelines.

You are likely not going to find it for much cheaper without cutting corners to be honest (i.e. going with an unproven and/or inexperienced practitioner using God-knows-what-brand).

I believe Avanti Derma does offer HA but they don't really advertise it much because PMMA & Ellanse likely make up 95%+ of their penile filler procedures. As a matter of fact, I'm inclined to wonder if their prices are any better than state-side prices; they aren't going to be stocking it in bulk like they would PMMA & Ellanse.

Try sending them another email, it wouldn't hurt. They simply may be inundated with inquiry.

Texas wrote: Although it is recommended to start stretching as soon as possible for many reasons, I think that as soon as you are ready you will be able to hang and stretch and work to get your gains still, Especially if you havent and are not retracting. Due the ligaments having been cut and the penis pulled out - you have new penis and tissue waiting to be pulled on. So dont beat your self up yet, Even though i know it sucks to think about, I think you will ok once you get to doing it all.

Thank you for the encouragement, and I also like to think that once I can start stretching, I will still be able to have good results. The surgeon who did my surgery used techniques to prevent retraction. Second, the phimosis has improved a lot, so I might not need a circumcision to resolve the phimosis.

Dekachin wrote: I had my lig cut in 2018. Looking back I have no regrets, but I also do not think it's a very necessary surgery to undergo.

The flaccid gain can be obtained via manuals and stretching and I'm not sure if it caused any flaccid or erect gains in length to be faster as a result of the surgery.

Erection angle was not really affected, just a very small change of angle when erect.

Other then that, my opinion is if you can save some money, there is no need for this surgery. Girth fillers like Ellanse with Dr Oates on the other hand are a game changer.

I do not want to discourage anyone either, but I think your advice is very good. Girth enhancement will make a huge difference in perception, but it is likely that the persons interested in ligamentolysis have too high expectations. Even surgeons admit that this is a big problem. Not so much the result of the surgery, which seems to be as expected for most everyone; instead, it is the problem that people have too high expectations, whereas their expectations when it comes to girth enhancement can be fulfilled. This is something that I often read that dissatisfaction from ligamentolysis is not because the surgery was bad, but because those people who underwent it had too high expectations.

I want to add one thing that I read: after having combined ligamentolysis and filler, it will NOT be possible to use the penile traction device for 15 days post-surgery for those who are circumcised, and for those who are uncircumcised until foreskin swelling has gone down. The foreskin swelling might be so severe that it is phimosis, and in this case the delay will be even longer, until the phimosis is resolved either by healing or circumcision.

I found three huge studies where people had undergone both ligamentolysis and fat transfer:

Composite augmentation phalloplasty: personal experience after 275 patients: parjournal.net/article/view/58#B15

Cosmetic penile enhancement surgery: a 3-year single-centre retrospective clinical evaluation of 355 cases: www.nature.com/articles/s41598-019-41652-w

These studies do not make it out to be a problem to combine both procedures, and the results seem very good, with few complications. Even so, based on what I read, I have a better impression of hyaluronic acid.

As for myself: the dermal fat graft that I had seems to have had a rather acceptable aesthetic and functional outcome, but in retrospect after having done more research, I think the procedure is too invasive. If some friend spontaneously asked me now what I would recommend? I would tell them to try hyaluronic acid without any other surgery.

I had dermal fat graft inserted 9 weeks ago, and now I suffer from phimosis too. The surgeon told me to wait another month, and I consulted with many urologists who basically said:

1. Either it will resolve by itself in time
2. Circumcision will be needed

I am very curious what you were told about the circumcision? after having had fillers? Did the doctor mention there was a much higher risk to perform the circumcision?

Phimosis is relatively common, and circumcision is very common, but none of the urologists I spoke to have any experience with penile enhancement and how it might affect circumcision.

A general physician who is a personal friend told me "off-the-record" that it should be no different, but he said that when the urologist/surgeon hears about penile enhancement they will be terrified. It is understandable too if they have no experience. I fear I might have to travel abroad to see the surgeon who performed my procedure to have the circumcision done if it is turns out it is needed.

WildBill wrote: Thanks for the reply and advice. My only hesitation with getting circumcised is the cost and the loss of sensation that can occur.

Has anyone here had Ellansé that is uncut and managed to keep it out of the foreskin? If so, what technique did you use?

Before I can have Ellansé I have to have a 6ml HA test procedure at Androfill anyway so will see how that goes.

Finally, I wrote a really long post about my experience of having a thin girth 4.2”-4.5” and sleeping with over 100 women to provide a counter balance to the amount of posts about women loving 6”+ girth but it wouldn’t post and came up with an error. Is this a glitch or as a new member can I not start a new thread?

Thanks again.

I will provide before and after pics/posts once I have something to show.

I'm so sorry about the glitch - I would advise typing it in a desktop notepad first (or mobile notepad) then copying and pasting it. I'd hate for you to lose all that all over again and I'll see what might have caused it.

And I'm impressed at your 100+ ladies with that girth. I say that respectfully, as I originally started thinner and was mortified of hooking up, largely due to my girth. So I'm curious to hear your story.

As for the test HA, that's not a bad idea. You won't have much in the way of gains but it could provide you some indication on what to expect regarding cut-vs-uncut. As for Ellanse & uncircumcision/circumcision, I would use the Search tab on this site and on the older site ( PhalloBoards 2.0 ), then type "Ellanse" and just put in the reading, it'll be worth your time.

In my frank assessment, if I was going for "big gains," I'd seriously consider circumcision if I was already uncut. If you are going for low-to-modest gains, you can probably get away with it. Being uncut isn't a "filler death sentence" but (again, being frank) some of the most experienced penile injectors have told me straight up that they much prefer to have circumcised patients.

If I were you I'd try and research adult male circumcision and see if you can find any well-reviewed practitioners. A few of the Sponsors here perform it, so you can always reach out to them as well. Or maybe you decide against it. Good luck in your decision making process.