TOPIC: LONG TERM PMMA SIDE EFFECTS

Hans, I hope that is not the case! But if you have not already done it, post lots of pictures, some very good advice and opinions from some of our members might be able to help!

Temporary fillers seem like a safer option.manual stretching is the safest option.i am seriously considering getting my PMMA removed when i can afford it.seems like i\'ve had an allergic reaction to it/bad foreign body response.It is slowly getting worse.now im getting constant urethral pain/black dots/discolouration on the head.I am trying to cope with the pain/irritation, but just want it gone.Some peoples bodies don\'t seem to respond well to the PMMA.

Always remember that you can only judge PMMA PE against other forms of PE. From that point of view everything he\'s said about PMMA is true of the other methods and probably to a far greater extent. He recommends Dr Comacho, but he performs FFT and Dermal Grafts. Has the Dr you spoke to seen what these look like 5-10 years down the line? We\'ve got members here such as ripple (FFT) and the seeker (DFG) who can vouch for the fact fact turns fibrotic. We\'ve got loads of members who can vouch for the fact scar tissue forms round silicon and can cause permanent problems. Justave and PMMApossibly can both demonstrate how Belloderm/Alloderm also harden and turns fibrotic, the graft contracts and the penis bends like a banana.

The first thing to remember whenever considering PE is that these procedures have a terrible track record and therefore in the vast majority of cases the best option is to do nothing. If doing nothing isn\'t an option, then you have to judge each option against each other and not against the standards expected in other forms of plastic surgery. From that point of view, despite the concerns people like the Mexican Dr might have, in my opinion, PMMA is still probably going to prove to be the best option for most people.

For me personally, I don\'t feel comfortable committing to PMMA yet and have ruled out every surgical option. So like your Dr suggests, I\'m looking at temporary solutions like Voluma. When i considered self injection Voluma was very tempting.

@xiaflexed i just read darkstaff post about having his PMMA removed. im thinking that how well ones body reacts to PMMA is on an individual basis. i think im going to actually get PMMA in another part of my body first to see how my body reacts to it. if all goes well thereafter ill take the plunge. till then Ill probably look into the voluma.

What I meant is that in all this time he had no complications, even today everything is fine.

Hi Mudball and Jmanning, I have posted a thread in the patient support forums on my black dots and discolouration issues.I had the procedure performed almost 3 months ago.I do agree that some people most definetly have issues with the body not liking the PMMA and some are fine.

I do not have a medical background. And I have not had PMMA injected in my penis. I hope this procedure works but the evidence of safety is not there for me yet. There are too many uncertainties i the whole process. First, there is the PMMA. I don\'t know whether the metacrill factory is clean and whether the product is made 100% of a the right size so that phagocytes don\'t move the spheres to other parts of the body. I know that artefill is better but it is prohibitively expensive.So, the first compromise is too accept risk with the metacrill. Then there is the fact that no doctors in Europe, US or Canada do this procedure. That is a lot of doctors who won\'t do it. On the other hand, there is one guy in Mexico and a few more in Brazil. The fact that Dr C lives in San Diego but practices in Mexico tells me all I need to know about his lower ethical standards. The fact that he is a nice guy matters for squat with me. Call me a snob, but I trust the judgment of the first world doctors, the medical associations and the FDA. No reputable medical association supports this procedure. So there is that. The science is incomplete. There are some studies of 1 or 2 cc in the face. But hardly any where guys have 20-60 cc of PMMA and the lower standards of the Mexican medical association. The inflammatory reaction that causes the collagen growth is not well understood. The long term effects are not known at all. Guys in their 20\'s will want to use their penis when they are 45 years old. What will the scar tissue/collagen/fibrosis be like then? Who knows.

So, the product is dodgy, the doctor is dodgy and the science is dodgy. I have a healthy 6x4.5 penis. I would like to make it thicker but I am not going to roll the dice with so many variables. Personally, I would consider a temporary filler. It is undoable with time if it is a problem. Injecting product into my penis based on the cheaper price of PMMA seems crazy to me. I will not trade safety to save a few thousand bucks up front.

@jmanning

In regards to your last statement, temp fillers will not product any permanent gains. Take for example Radiesse. The new collagen is produced so the body can surround the synthetic microspheres which are made from calcium and something else. The reason it is temporary is because the body can slowly break down, by enzymes, the spheres. As they are broken down, the body will stop producing collagen and will breakdown existing collagen that was produced only to encapsulate the original spheres. That is why the product loses volume in the proceeding months.

Although, there seems to be evidence that some of that collagen will last up to 1-2 years with Radiesse. So there may be longer term results from its use but touch ups will inevitably be required if one wants to maintain the Girth. No permanent gains should be expected.

@musky this is exactly what the other dr in tj said regarding dr c and the entire PMMA procedure.....however not as blunt.

@musky. what is your background? you seem to have a strong opinion about PMMA in general. are/were you a considering PMMA at one point in time and decided not to based on your findings?

how do you feel about a temporary fillers? You stated \"The collagen growth is an immune response to a foreign body (the implant). The collagen forms a capsule and fibrosis in an attempt to make a wall between the foreign body and the PMMA. No one knows what that will do to the body after 5 or more years.\" Considering this statement, in theory would the body not also form collagen capsules and fibrosis with a temp filler? eventually the temp filler will dissipate and the new collagen formation from the temp filler will stay. no? in theory this seems to be the safest way of Girth enhancement. it may run you 8-10k$ a year but eventually after every year, the new collagen growth from each procedure will yield permanent results. no?

what are your final thoughts/advice about PMMA to prospective customer like myself?

Musky wrote: When complications occur, guys are not flying back to TJ. They see serious we\'ll-trained first world doctors for treatment. Too many guys on this board think that the friendliness of Dr C and staff is a substitute for professional judgment. Dr C shows poor professional judgment. ( I don\'t question he is sful with a cannula but that is not the exercise of good judgment in using PMMA) He gives guys 30% PMMA to meet their wishes rather than assessing their safety.he does this despite his own professional doubts. He modifies techniques by trial and error. Think about that. He is totally out of step with the rest of the medical community...literally thousands of doctors. Dr C has a history of using all kinds of injectable products that he later abandons. He\'s reckless.

I agree with parts of this, but not all.

If you\'d had experience with PE related problem, you\'d be less enthusiastic about \"serious well trained first world doctors.\" They are very rarely interested in investigating these type of things and would much rather simply cut things out. Why go to the effort of researching a product and take the risk of giving the wrong advice or diagnosis, when it is much easier to simply cut it out? It doesn\'t matter where you go in the world, I bet as long as the Dr isn\'t responsible for the initial problem, he\'ll feel totally justified in doing surgery and expect the patient to simply accept the consequences that come with it.

In my personal opinion I agree that Dr C shows poor professional judgement at times.

Modifying technique by trial and error is totally normal, so this is an unfair criticism. However, I wish he would be much more conservative in how he does this and not charge the full amount, as clearly he hasn\'t got his procedure to where he wants it to be yet. I bet with a few months of conservative experimentation and much better tracking of results, he could start to get much more consistent results.

He\'s not way out of step with the rest of the medical community. In countries where a patent for PMMA isn\'t held, it\'s a very popular procedure. To think that it wouldn\'t be used routinely in America if it wasn\'t for Artefil is naive.

He doesn\'t have a history of abandoning all kinds of injectable products. Why say he does? It sounds like you just made this up. He was one of the Dr\'s who promoted the discontinuation of Bio Alcamid as the complication rates were higher than those shown in the studies. He was using it to treat HIV treatments who had facial wasting. As I understand it, when it became apparent that the complication rates were higher than what had been reported, he was at the forefront of the campaign against the product. But literally thousands of Dr\'s around the world were similarly mislead, including Mr Viel, a well known plastic surgeon here in the UK that is often mentioned on the board.

In my opinion, I kind of also agree that he is reckless. Actually maybe \"reckless\" is over the top, but I do think he isn\'t cautious enough.

Read the posts by fran_berlin who had pmma in 2007 and had it removed in 2012. He said this:


\"\"The dermatologist and the surgeon, before the operation, both told me it seems it is something not bad (no cancer) but after the analysis from the laboratory from the tissue, the surgeon told me the tissue had characterictics towards what it known to be a possibility to be develop as a cancer
but after he told not to worry\"\"


The collagen growth is an immune response to a foreign body (the implant). The collagen forms a capsule and fibrosis in an attempt to make a wall between the foreign body and the pmma. No one knows what that will do to the body after 5 or more years. See www.journalofdst.org/Journal/pdf/Septemb...OL-2-5-SYM3-WARD.pdf

Of course Wade has not seen blood flow issues. He has not seen any cases more than 3 or 4 years old. When complications occur, guys are not flying back to TJ. They see serious we\'ll-trained first world doctors for treatment.

Too many guys on this board think that the friendliness of Dr C and staff is a substitute for professional judgment. Dr C shows poor professional judgment. ( I don\'t question he is sful with a cannula but that is not the exercise of good judgment in using pmma) He gives guys 30% pmma to meet their wishes rather than assessing their safety.he does this despite his own professional doubts. He modifies techniques by trial and error. Think about that. He is totally out of step with the rest of the medical community...literally thousands of doctors. Dr C has a history of using all kinds of injectable products that he later abandons. He\'s reckless.

What\'s the reason for injecting things into your penis. I don\'t get it an it seems crazy to me.

@ mustang. this was back in december so dont quote me verbatim on wades actually response. but he said something to the nature of what most informed guys here on the board already know. the penis forms its own scar tissue and collagen but hes never heard of it disturbing blood flow. he said he will consult with dr c. and another dr in brazil that has been performing this procedure with PMMA longer than dr c.

later when i spoke with him again he said he has not heard of none of these complications to date. idk. Im hoping its true. I really want to move forward but not if the procedure makes my penis is inoperable 6,7,years down the line. i would like to personally speak to someone here that has had PMMA for more than 5 years.

jmanning wrote: @Mustang2020 just for the record mustang I, in no way shape or form want to discourage or instill fear in anyone that is considering PMMA. I just wanted some opinions as I myself personally would like to move forward with Dr C. Ive already spoken to wade and ran this information from said DR past him... I know you\'ve had PMMA for quite some time now. how long exactly has it been since your first procedure? btw appreciate your opinion..

what did Wade say about the other Mexican Dr\'s comments?

I have had the 1st session about 2.5 years ago now. So far, knock on wood, no complications apart from some aesthetic issues that I hope will be fixed in my next round.

@olafspo ... yes we get that but what member are you talking about that had PMMA done for 2 decades now?