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TOPIC: Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA?

Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269491739

@EQ
Thank you very much EQ for bringing this point for me:-
In his e-mail was he talking about a serious distant organ complication from the migration of the phagocytosed small beads or he was talking only about the chances of foreign body formation from these small beads ??(which Dr.Cohen said the best treatment for FBG is to leave it alone for spontaneous remission).
He mentioned only that small beads can cause FBG . And the chances of FBG formation in the Brazilian products are higher.
So are you saying FBG is a very serious complication and it is the biggest fear for you.

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269492832

have a read of this page
web.me.com/drcasavantes/PMMA_Monograph/Welcome.html

and this one
web.me.com/drcasavantes/PMMA_Monograph/C..._Brands_of_PMMA.html

and this is most relevant to this topic
web.me.com/drcasavantes/PMMA_Monograph/PMMA.html

(the friend who forwarded it to me said this site is still a work in progress)

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269493090

FROM ARTICLE

Approximately 20 days after grafted, fibroblasts migrate to the area and start producing collagen around the micro-spheres. It is important to remember that the inflammatory response has two synergic phases: inflammation and Repair.
The first phase is intended to destroy, dilute or isolate offensive agents and affected cells; the second phase cures and reconstructs the harmed tissues.
The Repair phase begins simultaneously with the inflammatory phase, but ends when the offensive factor is controlled.
This explains why the micro-spheres of PMMA must be between 40 and 60 microns in diameter: if they were smaller than 20 microns, they would be phagocyted; if they were between 20 and 40 microns, they will be phagocyted, but the macrophages will die creating a chronic inflammatory process. If the particles were larger than 60 microns, they will trigger a foreign body reaction.
The picture on the left shows the distribution of PMMA ranging from 40-60 microns, 6 months after the grafting in human tissues.



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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269494647

@ eq and smartman

do we know how long after her injections her Necrosis started?

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269485488

I have mentioned before if a doctor wants to use a sharp needle (instead of the blunt micro-cannula) for the injection of PMMA he has to use the technique back & forth (injecting PMMA while withdrawing the needle) and never inject at REST.
I think most of the doctors in the US use a sharp needle for Artefill injection into the face and I have never read any case of skin Necrosis or blindness in the US, because they use the technique I have mentioned above.
e.g. watch the technique of this doctor during the injection of Artefill he is doing it while withdrawing the needle :-

The doctor has to be well trained about how to inject Artefill in a safe way.
Injecting the beads directly into a vessel (an artery or a vein) e.g. a sharp needle ---> serious complications (embolism).
In the other hand injecting the beads outside a blood vessel, the beads cannot enter the blood vessel by itself ---> i.e. NO embolism.
To prove that for you :- There are thousands of patients in the US who had Artefill injection into the face (which contains a lot of arteries and veins) by using a sharp needle but without any serious complications e.g blindness or skin Necrosis i.e. No beads had entered the blood vessels because these doctors are well trained.
If Dr.C. or any other doctors using a sharp needle for PMMA injection (e.g. in the US) and if they had one case of e.g. blindness , would we think they will continue to use it ??

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269482553

supa wrote: Re: The horror picture portraying a disfigured face.

It would seem down to poor technique; I read in the article:

Not the product is to blame then, if we take the excerpt literally, but rather the location where it was injected.

Thoughts?'

If it was injected into the artery, that is poor technique and physician error. Very near branches of the ophthalmic artery should be fine. The material is not supposed to move. That would not be considered poor technique. In the nasogenian grove should be fine. The material is not supposed to move. That would not be considered poor technique. Very near the right facial artery should be fine. The material is not supposed to move. That would not be considered poor technique. Here is a video of Dr. C injecting into the glabellar region. He is using a microcanula so not likely to puncture a blood vessel (not impossible, just not very likely). How near is he to branches of the ophthalmic artery?

supa wrote: 'At the same time I did resent your patronizing attitude when replying to smartman '

I looked back at my exchanges with smartman and there isn't anything I would change. If you believe that the answers to the list of questions asked would provide value to you, as opposed to another list of questions for each answer and so on resulting in an endless debate that no one cares about, then I hope someone answers them.

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269475040

Re: The horror picture portraying a disfigured face.

It would seem down to poor technique; I read in the article:

\" ... the PMMA microspheres were injected very near branches of the ophthalmic artery, which caused embolism in the vassel.2 We also know of complications also associated with the use of an autologous graft when the injection is carried out in the glabellar region.6
In this report, the complication mechanism was similar. PMMA was injected in the nasogenian groove, or directly into the right facial artery, or very near it. There was arterial embolism: right angular artery, right superior and inferior labial coronal arteries\".

Not the product is to blame then, if we take the excerpt literally, but rather the location where it was injected.

Thoughts?

P.S.
I truly and deeply think that challenging info/doc/research documents are absolutely crucial for our long journey to a thorough assessment of PMMA. Thank you eqstudent for your contributions. Please, keep it up.

At the same time I did resent your patronizing attitude when replying to smartman. He has brought wealth of technical info to this forum on top of sharing his long-term experience with us: both extremely valuable assets.
I personally would welcome more imperturbability when objecting to points of view of a fellow forum brother. Rest assured that I still would avidily read your inputs. We are all here to learn and contribute. Btw, I confess, I do ignore the basic facts of biology, so I am happy to know more.

Final question: you \"will not be using Artefill for chin augmentation\" ... would you use Artefill for penis Girth augmentation?


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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269475202

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@Jec You indicated that you are 50/50. Perhaps you want to reschedule so that you can do more research and feel more comfortable with your decision, whether it\'s to go forward or not go forward. It\'s important to research and understand all potential risks before proceeding, if you do indeed decide to proceed.

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269475232

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@ttar: Is the problem still happening? I am not experiencing similar issues. Is it localized to this thread, or do other threads have that appearance as well?
@eq Is post 20 still only partially showing up? I am not having any problems.

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269476453

@skatezy - I cannot see most of post #20. Issues with the thread?

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269477533

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Hm, I\'ll pass word along that multiple people are having issues.

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269477847

The Rt. facial necrosis in the picture is due to a bad technique (the doctor has injected pmma into an artery (branches of the facial artery)) esp. if the doctor used a sharp needle for the injection, they usually advice in pmma injection is to use a blunt cannula or if the doctor used a sharp needle he shouldn\'t inject the pmma at rest he should move the needle back & forth and the injection should be done during the movement to avoid any direct injection of pmma into an artery.
It has nothing to do with the amount of pmma it is due to the technique e.g. :-
A small volume of pmma injected by a sharp needle into an artery ----> a chance of necrosis.
A large volume of pmma injected by a blunt cannula and not into an artery--> no necrosis.
A necrosis of a tissue from an arterial embolism is not a long term complication it is an acute short term complication hours after the injection.
But if the injection was into a vein ---> possibility of pulmonary embolism
BTW the volume injected in the butt (around 500 cc) is 10 times more by volume than typically injected in the penis (around 50 cc in total) and I have never read any report of skin or tissue necrosis of the butt.
I agree with supa that there are other products beside pmma if you injected them in an artery---> embolism---> serious complication.
e.g. injecting steroid into the inferior turbinate (inside the nose) (used to be one of the treatment for chronic nasal block (allergic or vasomotor rhinitis)) can cause blindness
archopht.ama-assn.org/cgi/content/abstract/97/1/79
My doctor in Brazil used a micro-cannula during the injection of Metacrill but in some area of my penis he wanted to use a sharp needle (back & forth technique) but I refused even he told me he has a long experience of using a sharp needle. So I am sure some brazilian doctors still sometimes used a sharp needle beside the micro-cannula (so it is not a 100% a bioplasty technique (a blunt micro-cannula) what Dr.Almir Nacul has advised).
So the technique of the doctor is most important to avoid any serious complication and not the product per se.

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269478739

Some people think that FFT injection is the safest method which has no serious complication and only has a low risk, I would like to know their opinion after they read these information would they still have FFT injection??? :-
(1) Danger in Glabellar injection page 461.
(2) Blindness and central nervous system injury (in a 24 y.o. lady after Fat injection about 0.5 ml in her Rt. nasal tip) page 461.
So it was only 0.5 cc of fat which had caused this serious complication and not the 20 cc pmma into a penis.
In fft injection you can also get :-
Absorption , infection (mycobacterial??) antibiotic before and after injection is advised , pulmonary thromboembolism , pseudotumor , skin necrosis , calcification , penile and urethral distortion , cavernous sinus thrombosis , big cyst formation , ossification and lipomatous hypertrophy (please, check the picture of the penis in fig. 54. 3 in page 422 in the following web-site) :-
books.google.co.uk/books?id=K-HYbvHxcKcC...t%20transfer&f=false
I think I should start a new thread about infections , complications , risks of FFT ???


So in conclusion:- as I have mentioned before it is the Technique and not the product per se.




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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269479061

I am not saying that PMMA is without any complications , you can have a serious complication if your doctor used a bad technique even if the product of PMMA was the best ( e.g. Artefill).
In PMMA injection you must find a very experience doctor who has done many cases and has a very good reputation, otherwise dont do it .
We are all here in this forum trying to help each other , and all of us want the best for our penises .
I dont need to convince anybody to have penile PMMA, everyone should do his research and find out what is the best for his penis .
I think all of us would like to have a permanent Girth enhancement with the lowest risks.
I found the product what I was looking for but I am sure some people like other products and they have good results too.

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Infections, Complications, Risks of PMMA? 12 years 8 months ago #1269480216

Also in my opinion in regard of the possibility of skin Necrosis and other arterial emboli from PMMA or other material injection :-
e.g. Injecting 20 cc Newplastic into my penis with a blunt micro-cannula is safer than injecting :-
1 cc of Artefill into my naso-labial fold (skin Necrosis) or 0.1-0.2 cc 0f steroid injection inside my nose (blindness) or0.5 cc of FFT into the tip of my nose (blindness and central nervous system injury) with a sharp needle.

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