TOPIC: What's the worst that can happen?

First of all I want to say thank you because I live in Miami and I only about 6 months ago found out that it was actually possible to increase one's Girth through surgical methods when I found the website of Dr. Loria, who is local here in my area. Ever since then, I had been saving my money and looking forward to the day when I could afford the procedure, with every intention of going right to his clinic.

I can't even remember what it was that I was searching for, that ended up with me seeing this forum and checking it out, but thanks to you guys, I am now aware of the dangers of silicone injections and to stay away from Loria's clinic.

I've spent a lot of time here however it is a bit difficult to find answers to specific information, and if I could add a little feedback I think it would be really helpful if you provided some kind of stickies breaking down the basics of everything.

Anyway I have a couple questions primary is, what's the worst that can happen? I have seen a lot of people say 'you're taking a big risk and if you aren't very undersized it isn't worth it'. So I'm wondering does anyone really know how high the chance of complications are? And what are the worst possible complications that you can encounter? The two procedures which interest me are PMMA and Ellanse.

These procedures require the skin to be pierced, so given how even a tiny scratch can get infected and cause death, then at an extreme, then I suppose dying is the worst that can happen. I've seen a case of Fournier's Gangrene described in the literature as a result of PMMA injection, but it's not actually due to the PMMA, but rather injecting it without being sufficiently sanitized. We have actually had a member of this forum suffer from this after having just a small amount of HA injected.

But I suppose the worse that can happen in the context you are asking would be complications that lead to shaft skin loss. A long lasting inflammatory reaction that doesn't respond to non surgical therapies and therefore requires Removal of the filler, can necessitate Removal of shaft skin. Necrosis can also occur in the filler if injected into a vein and blocks blood flow. I've not seen these complications as a result of PMMA or Ellanse to date. Though I've seen people who have had reactions to PMMA so bad that they decided to have it removed, but luckily the shaft skin was preserved. I've not seen this with Ellanse, but of course, only a tiny fraction of the amount of guys who have had PMMA have had Ellanse.

I have been admonished in the past here telling my story. I don’t mean to place fear into anyone’s mind, just logic. However, your thread asked what is the worst. I may not be the worst but the past two years has gone poorly for me.
I had 8cc of Bellafill PMMA filler placed by a midwest Chicago derm. Ever since I have had a bad foreign body reaction with pain and chronic swelling. It has been so bad I even went to Gelman in Cali to have removed. PMMA cannot be entirely removed and the chronic inflammation reaction is the same or worse post Removal. I may need to go in again to try to remove more. If this doesn’t work I will need to have the shaft skin removed. I have talked and consulted with Dr Solomon, Dr Alter, Dr Gelman, Dr Angermeier in Cleveland Clinic. The best of the best state side. They all are extremely against injecting material into once’s penis. If you did decide, I would only stick with HA. However it really is temporary and the risks of vessel injury or infection is there. Try to be happy with what u have.

There are 2 sides to the possible 'worst'. Infection is probably the big one. I know of 2, not actually done by me, both of which needed to be opened surgically and have the pus washed out. They were pretty sick and it could have, but didn't, progressed to Fournier's Gangrene. FG would be more of a risk in insulin dependent diabetes or other immune suppressed state. I have been PM'ed here by guys with skin loss post injection. I have been surprised by how well the penis can heal up an area of skin loss.

Chronic pain has been reported here by a few guys. As far as I know just with stimulatory fillers. Chronic pain does not need to have a significant underlying problem and may require treatment on its own without trying to 'fix' the penis.

The other 'worst' is more psychological. It may be following a significant problem. It may follow what others may think of as a minor problem. But if you just cannot bear the thought of anything going wrong with a treatment of your penis then better to keep away for injectable PE.

Toothman wrote: I have been admonished in the past here telling my story. I don’t mean to place fear into anyone’s mind, just logic. However, your thread asked what is the worst. I may not be the worst but the past two years has gone poorly for me.
I had 8cc of Bellafill PMMA filler placed by a midwest Chicago derm. Ever since I have had a bad foreign body reaction with pain and chronic swelling. It has been so bad I even went to Gelman in Cali to have removed. PMMA cannot be entirely removed and the chronic inflammation reaction is the same or worse post Removal. I may need to go in again to try to remove more. If this doesn’t work I will need to have the shaft skin removed. I have talked and consulted with Dr Solomon, Dr Alter, Dr Gelman, Dr Angermeier in Cleveland Clinic. The best of the best state side. They all are extremely against injecting material into once’s penis. If you did decide, I would only stick with HA. However it really is temporary and the risks of vessel injury or infection is there. Try to be happy with what u have.

For the love of all that's holy, you weren't admonished for telling your story, you were admonished for antagonizing every comment associated with PMMA for a short while and were told to stop.

You had decided to get work done with an inexperienced practitioner with no reviews using an iteration of PMMA that hasn't been reviewed for penile application --> double cardinal sins, on top of having warnings here about making such errors along the way.

All you had to do is write this exact same comment (quoted above) without the first sentence! Your story is a necessary part of the narrative and sorely needed around here, however your petty side comments are not. I'm making this very clear one last time. If you wish to respond to this, Email or PM me, otherwise let's have this topic resume, thanks.
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If I might then ask a follow up question or two: these worst case scenarios frankly sound terrifying. But I am guessing these are very rare scenarios? So my follow up would be, what are the most common complications, and do we have any real clue or data as to exactly how common they are? 3%? 1%?

Finally I get the point that there is a lot less data on the Ellanse procedure so maybe this can't be answered but, does it stand to reason that the Ellanse procedure is safer and has fewer complications, if for no other reason than the simple fact that it does disappear naturally over time?

I want to preface my response with.... I had my filler in US with Bellafill and not with Dr C. It sounds like Dr C has a lot of experience with PMMA and a fair amount with Ellanse.

I have read studies that say granulomas happen about 1 out of a thousand when PMMA is used as a filler. I have also read studies that say PMMA does better when placed deep in thicker tissue that does not move much. I would not be surprised if the likelihood of granulomas is fairly higher because the penis is off label and the skin is thin and moveable.

To answer your second question, it would make sense that complications are less with Ellanse. However, Ellanse is a relatively new filler compared to PMMA. Sooooo, there is less data on it. However, both PMMA and Ellanse stimulate collagen formation. PMMA study says it last 5 yrs but the PMMA itself stays forever. Ellanse has differing lengths of degradation. In theory Ellanse should dissolve over time. However, Ellanse may last longer than the stated life span. Plus during the time one has it, one May still form a granulomas.

So in summary, Ellanse seems a bit safer because over time it should disappear, however I think the debate is still ongoing.

gamblinsam wrote: If I might then ask a follow up question or two: these worst case scenarios frankly sound terrifying. But I am guessing these are very rare scenarios? So my follow up would be, what are the most common complications, and do we have any real clue or data as to exactly how common they are? 3%? 1%?

Finally I get the point that there is a lot less data on the Ellanse procedure so maybe this can't be answered but, does it stand to reason that the Ellanse procedure is safer and has fewer complications, if for no other reason than the simple fact that it does disappear naturally over time?

The trouble is, not all PMMA procedures are the same. So, even if I were to make an educated guess on the serious complication rate, then it's not necessarily all that helpful. I've always been of the opinion that cosmetic PE isn't sufficiently "safe" for anyone other than smaller guys, with real size based hang ups and even then a very conservative approach should be taken. I think we'd have an incredibly high satisfaction rate if that was the case. However, the reality is, that most guys aren't looking for a conservative increase in size and therefore, many end up getting multiple rounds of high concentration PMMA. Of all the late onset serious complications that I've witness on here, I don't think there have been any that haven't occurred with patients who have had very large volumes injected over multiple rounds. Would this complication rate be significantly lower if everyone had received 2 rounds or less of low concentration PMMA? I can't say for sure, but I'd be very confident it would.

If I were to guess the rate of guys who seriously regretted getting PMMA, I'd personally say about 5%. That might seem high and I suspect most people on here would disagree, but I think it's about right. However, as I've already said, I think the "regret" rate will be significantly lower among those who achieved more modest gains, with just one round and then perhaps a second touch up round. In fact, other than Darkstaff, I can't think of anyone of Dr C's PMMA patients, who had a serious issue, with just one round and there are quite a number of guys who go that route.

As for Ellanse, it's safer in terms of later onset problems, as it should only last 3-4 years. But if you have a serious issue prior to that, I'm not convinced it's particularly safer. I will say it's a very good option though and we've seen some fantastic results, with relatively small amounts.

There is also the option of HA. From my observation it isn't as good for PE, or as long lasting, as the collagen stimulating fillers, but it can be reversed if you don't like it.

Ultimately, there just isn't a risk free way on enlarging your penis. So, unless it's really bothering you, then maybe it isn't worth the risk. What is your current size?

I am currently 5" in Girth so I realize this is average and, at least 'acceptable' or 'good enough' for most women. And in fact I've had plenty of women say that sex with me is incredible. But at the same time, I've also heard enough women make comments like 'yeah, he's an asshole but what can I say, he's got a big Dick!' or even a few women specifically say I wasn't big enough for them. And the truth is, I can get it up to about 6.5" with a pump and not one single woman hasn't confirmed she was a lot happier with that so... that stuff sticks in your head!

I wouldn't say it's an insecurity thing so much as it's a "I want to be the best I can be" thing, if that makes sense. The same reason I work out and eat healthy and groom myself well, I just know that women appreciate it and I want to be making the women I sleep with as happy as I can. Maybe I'd say it's in the 15-20% insecurity range, with 80-85% simply wanting to improve the experience of the women I'm sleeping with. There was ONE girl who I was very serious with and dated for about 5 years, and she specifically stated that she really wished it was bigger several times, and that definitely stuck. But I've had such a large number of other, positive reviews, that I do realize it's not a 'problem' at least, for the majority of women.

PRINCE fro the Batman Album , Vicki Waiting -

The phone rings, it's Vicki callin'
She wants me to come to the crib
She says conversation's better than being lonely
So I try my best to ad lib
I told the joke about the woman
Who asked her lover "Why is your organ so small?"
He replied "I didn't know I was playin' in a cathedral."
Vicki didn't laugh at all.